Eve of the Apocalypse: Twilight

Mor’goroth
Blood Captain

Faction: Fel Orcs

Str 24 (2.45)
Int 16 (1.6)
Agi 12 (1.1)

Attack 66-74
Armor 15

Innate
Orc Lust
Senses the surrounding presence of magic, doubling any effects from buffs/debuffs for 12 seconds in an 700 AoE. Medium CD.

Crippling blow [Phyical]
Mor'goroth remembers the demonic effects that ravaged his once proud race, transferring his hate to his next attack. Grants the next attack 30/70/100/150/190/250 additional attack dmg (with a int-based modifier), but reduces agility by 5/10/15/20/25/30. Lasts for one strike, may not be combined with crits of any kind. Low CD. Single target nuke.
[Talent]
Demonic Sunder
Adds a debuff to CB that last 10 seconds. While under the effects, the afflicted target will loose 3/5/7 armor per second for 6 seconds. Also deals light, str-based DOT dmg for the duration, but penalizes the added attack from CB by 20/15/10%. 3 upgrades.

Orc Hide
[Passive] Awards a .5/1/1.5/2/2.5/3 HP regen and 10 armor.
[Active] Mor’goroth charges into battle, ignoring common sense in his bloodlust. While active, awards 5/10/15/20/25/30% additional armor and 30% increased MS, but takes 1 str, agil, and int per second away. Lasts 12-16 seconds. Medium CD. Self buff.

Passive aspect I know. PLEASE give some added thoughts on this one if you think it’s too bland or are just feeling creative

Blood Sacrifice
Kills an allied or enemy unit, granting certain effects based upon which unit killed. For allies, gives a boost in attack, armor, and a small HP regen. For enemies, reduces armor to 0 for x seconds and gives a 5/7/9/11/13/15% for one unit under BS to die every 2 seconds. Lasts 20 seconds. Medium CD. AoE effect buff/debuff.

Overpowering Rend
Deals x int-based, cleave dmg, effecting up to 6 units, depending on str: (0-50 str, 4 unit cleave; 50-100 str, 5 unit cleave; 100- str, 6 unit cleave). Also has a chance to removes any harmful effects afflicting Mor'goroth. Chance to cleanse himself increases per skill lvl. Small AoE nuke/dispeller.
[Talent]
Blood Rend
Adds an additional unit to the cleaving effect. Upgradeable 2 times.

Ultimate
Don’t know what the heck to think of. So…..HELP!

Okay. . .

Innate: Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Deathblow reduce attack damage of nearby units by 50%? Doubling that makes them useless for awhile. I'm also going to go ahead and look at AP here, as the Orcs only have 1 other hero to compare it to. Doubling things like Devouring Plague, Abberation, Ebb, and a couple others that I'll fail to mention would be making 'em pretty OP, while others would be brought up to par. Not a terrible idea, all in all, but it doesn't really work with the disparities that're currently in-game.

Crippling Blow: Seems easily offset by an item. Also, is this reduction permanent? Is it a buff that Orc Lust would cripple him with, early on? What's the duration of the agi reduction? Also, the fact that it is rather static (That is, no stat-based damage) would scale poorly with other heroes as they level, as their skills are, for the most part, dynamic.

Demonic Sunder: Again, I'd suggest stat-based stuff here, although having X increase slightly wouldn't be taken too poorly.

Orc Hide: Passive is meh. The active, again: What's this loss of stats? Is it permanent? If temporary, how long does it last?

Blood Sacrifice: So, you insta-kill one enemy unit, with a chance to kill another random one? Alright, although see Overpowering Rend. As for sacrificing allied units, I rarely see that happen in the games I'm in, although, again, stats could be included here.

Overpowering Rend: An AoE melee attack, really. Removing all buffs and debuffs from an area? But then, what's the point of Orc Lust, if you're not gonna use it whenever you're using this AoE damage? I mean, I suppose you could, but then you're only getting the area between 700 and 500 units. 500 units on in is dispelled by this ability. The same is true for Blood Sacrifice: You kill a unit, they get a debuff, which is then taken away by this. Wtf?

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Overall, I don't really see anything that would particularly make me want to play the hero. He seems okay, but a couple of the skills are confusingly-worded, and other spells contradict each other or aren't worth casting. More thought in the abilities, please.

EDIT: Fixed wording in Blood Sacrifice. My excuse is that it's 1 AM.

Ultimate: Degenerate's Blood (Passive Stack + Active Instantcast) (0 mana) (no cooldown)
Every time the blood captain kills a minor creep 1 is added to the stack. When activated the blood captain gains 522 movement speed and pathing turned off for stack seconds.

Sorry not very original, i'm kinda tired.

Crippling Blow: Seems easily offset by an item. Also, is this reduction permanent? Is it a buff that Orc Lust would cripple him with, early on? What's the duration of the agi reduction? Also, the fact that it is rather static (That is, no stat-based damage) would scale poorly with other heroes as they level, as their skills are, for the most part, dynamic.

Should have added more to this. Basically, its a one deal, uber heavy hit. The slow effect lingers for 3-6 seconds prolly. The DOT is....self-explanatory.

Overpowering rend is not a melee dmg spell. Please reread the description. And I understand it's 1 AM.

But then, what's the point of Orc Lust, if you're not gonna use it whenever you're using this AoE damage?

Well that's the trick, now isn't it? It's a situational spell. I'll look into that one though, it didn't get a whole lot of thought put into it.

Orc Hide: Passive is meh. The active, again: What's this loss of stats? Is it permanent? If temporary, how long does it last?

Uhm, I don't mean to sound harsh, but did you really read the whole concept, all the way through? I am starting to wonder. It is simple math, man, here:

but takes 1 str, agil, and int per second away. Lasts 12-16 seconds.

So...that would be 12-16 of each stat lost. Right?

Blood Sacrifice: So, you insta-kill one enemy unit, with a chance to kill another random one? Alright, although see Overpowering Rend. As for sacrificing allied units, I rarely see that happen in the games I'm in, although, again, stats could be included here.

What is your point? There are alot of skills with similar effects.

More thought in the abilities, please.

I'll do that.

And I appreciate the input. Really.

Dark_Nemesis wrote: Should have added more to this. Basically, its a one deal, uber heavy hit. The slow effect lingers for 3-6 seconds prolly. The DOT is....self-explanatory.

I'm not asking about the DoT. Nor any slow effect, which I don't see much of, unless you're talking about the Agi loss, in which case, a straight-up movement speed debuff is probably easier to do, and more effective.

Also, I understand that this is intended to be a large nuke. I don't see it mattering much when people start getting large -- or even medium -- amounts of armor, because the damage doesn't scale based on any stat this guy has. It scales based on level. Which, to be fair, other spells do too -- except the way they scale is multipliers of stats, not a straight number.

For instance: Yes, it may be a hit for 300 damage. . .which is not a lot for, say, any hero with a 3+ Orb of Life. Hell, that practically negates the damage dealt. Now, making it 300 + 1.2xStr would mean that the Str of the hero comes into play here, and it CAN be a heavy hit, modified by Fel Orc's strength value.

And you are reducing Agility. Okay. You make no mention of how long it is reduced, which was kinda the entire point of my criticism. You mention a cooldown, so I do imagine the Agi reduction is finite, but I -- and anyone else playing him -- don't know for how long.

DarkNemesis wrote:Overpowering rend is not a melee dmg spell. Please reread the description.

Well that's the trick, now isn't it? It's a situational spell. I'll look into that one though, it didn't get a whole lot of thought put into it.

Well. Let's see here. With a name like Overpowering Rend, it sure sounds melee. All it says is "Deals x int-based cleave damage, effecting up to y units. . .' You do mention an AoE. But when I read cleave, that means melee.

As for the Innate, I don't see as to how I would use it whenever I have any points in Overpowering Rend. Great, it doubles the debuffs or buffs of anyone within a certain range. Problem: Crippling Blow gives you a debuff. Orc Hide, unless you made it have a buff (somewhat difficult, at least as far as I can see), has no effect from it, unless it's activated. Blood Sacrifice has its use with Orc Lust, I suppose, but Overpowering Rend, if you use it any time after Orc Lust, essentially removes that effect (Doubled or not, the effect is removed entirely), while if you use it any time before Orc Lust, there is a small area that is effected, which is not, I think, what you intended with that spell.

DarkNemesis wrote:

Orc Hide: Passive is meh. The active, again: What's this loss of stats? Is it permanent? If temporary, how long does it last?

Uhm, I don't mean to sound harsh, but did you really read the whole concept, all the way through? I am starting to wonder. It is simple math, man, here:

but takes 1 str, agil, and int per second away. Lasts 12-16 seconds.

So...that would be 12-16 of each stat lost. Right?

Great. You lose 12-16 of each stat. FOR. HOW. LONG? I asked this multiple times. And I can say the 'did you really read the whole concept, all the way through?' to my post too. >_>

DarkNemesis wrote:

Blood Sacrifice: So, you insta-kill one enemy unit, with a chance to kill another random one? Alright, although see Overpowering Rend. As for sacrificing allied units, I rarely see that happen in the games I'm in, although, again, stats could be included here.

What is your point? There are alot of skills with similar effects.

My point is this: There may be other spells with similar effects, but none of the owners of that skill have within their grasp the means to remove the buff they just gave their team, which Overpowering Rend does, as it currently is.

A lot of this boils down to Overpowering Rend, really. I read 'removes any buffs/debuffs' and see that as, 'removes all buffs and debuffs within a 500 AoE'. I THINK you mean it as 'removes buffs from enemies, debuffs from allies', but I'm going off what you wrote, as I can't be sure of what you meant.

Great. You lose 12-16 of each stat. FOR. HOW. LONG? I asked this multiple times. And I can say the 'did you really read the whole concept, all the way through?' to my post too. >_>

Lasts 12-16 seconds.

It was there the whole time, which means you either didn't read it the whole way through or....?

Also, I understand that this is intended to be a large nuke. I don't see it mattering much when people start getting large -- or even medium -- amounts of armor, because the damage doesn't scale based on any stat this guy has. It scales based on level. Which, to be fair, other spells do too -- except the way they scale is multipliers of stats, not a straight number.

For instance: Yes, it may be a hit for 300 damage. . .which is not a lot for, say, any hero with a 3+ Orb of Life. Hell, that practically negates the damage dealt. Now, making it 300 + 1.2xStr would mean that the Str of the hero comes into play here, and it CAN be a heavy hit, modified by Fel Orc's strength value.

And you are reducing Agility. Okay. You make no mention of how long it is reduced, which was kinda the entire point of my criticism. You mention a cooldown, so I do imagine the Agi reduction is finite, but I -- and anyone else playing him -- don't know for how long.

Understood. My main concern was that if I attached a stat modifier it would quickly become/seem OP. I'll reduce the initial dmg delt and attach a modifier (Int or str prolly, I'm trying to avoid DPS sounding skills, as Mor'goroth is a tank with some PK potential). Appreciate the insight. Cleared some stuff up.

Well. Let's see here. With a name like Overpowering Rend, it sure sounds melee. All it says is "Deals x int-based cleave damage, effecting up to y units. . .' You do mention an AoE. But when I read cleave, that means melee.

Ok, to clear the wind, it is a melee attack that spreads out, dealing dmg in an AoE. Hence the "cleave". I'll rewrite this even though is sounds fairly simple to understand.

Some tweaking coming soon, bear with me. And Innate is getting scrapped. Any ideas for a new one?

And Crypt, I may sound harsh towards you, and you do frustrate me at times (here, for instance), but your criticism is highly regarded and helpful. I mean that too.

Dark_Nemesis wrote:

Great. You lose 12-16 of each stat. FOR. HOW. LONG? I asked this multiple times. And I can say the 'did you really read the whole concept, all the way through?' to my post too. >_>

Lasts 12-16 seconds.

It was there the whole time, which means you either didn't read it the whole way through or....?

I think maybe he was confused on what the 12-16 seconds applied to. He probably thought only to the buff, and not to the debuff, though it seemed to me that they were linked from the start.

You're talking about the armor buff right? Well, each buff lasts that long, the increased MS and armor, as well as the debuffs from his other stats. Sorry for any strangely-worded text.

AlienFromBeyond wrote: I think maybe he was confused on what the 12-16 seconds applied to. He probably thought only to the buff, and not to the debuff, though it seemed to me that they were linked from the start.

Correct. When I read that, I thought that the 12-16 seconds was for the active only, and the stat loss was longer. 'lasts 12-16 seconds', when I read it, was 'The ability lasts for 12-16 seconds.' Which is great, except I don't know how long / if the stats debuff applies longer. And if I read it that way, you can be sure other people might, too.

DarkNemesis wrote: Ok, to clear the wind, it is a melee attack that spreads out, dealing dmg in an AoE. Hence the "cleave". I'll rewrite this even though is sounds fairly simple to understand.

Hold on a second.

DarkNemesis wrote:Overpowering rend is not a melee dmg spell.

You just said it isn't melee, then it is. Unless you were talking about the 'spell' part of what I said, which is simple semantics. . .Whatever. Anywho, I do approve of the change to it, and if you keep it that way, I don't think the innate is too much trash anymore. The biggest problem I had with it was that the hero could dispel most of the effects of his own innate, which isn't the way to do things.

The "spell" part is AoE, the attack is not.

Look up the Sven hero on dota, he has a cleaving attack, this is what I am aiming for, only his is passive. Mine is intended to be more flexible and complex.

I'm glad you've gone back to making these.

Dark_Nemesis wrote:The "spell" part is AoE, the attack is not.

Look up the Sven hero on dota, he has a cleaving attack, this is what I am aiming for, only his is passive. Mine is intended to be more flexible and complex.

you do realize how much more complex the heroes in eota are by comparison to dota?

Try to think even more outside the box.

Yea, I know.

I'll do some major tweaking here. One of these days.