Eve of the Apocalypse: Twilight

There's something fundamentally wrong with the arcane generator. (Or it doesn't mesh with my playstyle at all.) It is primarily a defensive generator with a high energy cost. If you have trouble defending to the point you need the tower, you probably wouldn't have the energy necessary to deploy it. Furthermore, you need to place it in the right lane. This is why I've never been able to successfully deploy it on Stormwail and I only hear about it being used on Kedges, where energy is not a problem.

The shockwave goes over the whole map and damages buildings.

You propably used it wrong.

hmm. sounds like it would amplify the arthas strategy of causing mass damage to the other team's buildings.

Dekar wrote:The shockwave goes over the whole map and damages buildings.

You propably used it wrong.

You can't say it isn't weak tho.

But yeah, he probably used it wrong.

Its propably too weak as in taking 5 minutes to get enough mana for a single shockwave and afaik losing all mana when you lose an obe and the generator turns off.

Just a bit of history about arcane gens: They used to be completely map wide, and even with high cooldowns its power was just absurd. Then they got nerfed, then people stopped using them, and they sorta got forgotten.

As for the passive exp gain, and crystal gens - I'm considering removing both, but not one without the other.

DarnYak

DarnYak wrote:Just a bit of history about arcane gens: They used to be completely map wide, and even with high cooldowns its power was just absurd. Then they got nerfed, then people stopped using them, and they sorta got forgotten.

As for the passive exp gain, and crystal gens - I'm considering removing both, but not one without the other.

DarnYak

Reducing the number of obs on Stormwail also nerfed Arcane gens. They're obviously far more effective in large groups. It's extremely hard to have 25 energy, nowadays.

IMO, you shouldn't remove crystal gens, just nerf them. Gens that require more skill in planning and execution, and also more risk, should have greater payoffs than the ones which are completely passive.

The shockwave goes over the whole map and damages buildings.

You propably used it wrong.

Wait, I never actually figured out how much range arcane generators have, I assumed they only had something basic, like 1000. Do they all have global range or something obscene?

the range for most of them is about 3 screen lengths iirc

The shockwave has mapwide range but limited targeting distance as well as a wide wave (600) and full damage to buildings. A magic missile barrage has maybe a third of the length of Stormwail peak in range with low damage to buildings. A spike attack functions like a lightning storm and damages units in the aoe for 100 per spike for 30 seconds.

Discombobulator wrote:

DarnYak wrote:Just a bit of history about arcane gens: They used to be completely map wide, and even with high cooldowns its power was just absurd. Then they got nerfed, then people stopped using them, and they sorta got forgotten.

As for the passive exp gain, and crystal gens - I'm considering removing both, but not one without the other.

DarnYak

Reducing the number of obs on Stormwail also nerfed Arcane gens. They're obviously far more effective in large groups. It's extremely hard to have 25 energy, nowadays.

IMO, you shouldn't remove crystal gens, just nerf them. Gens that require more skill in planning and execution, and also more risk, should have greater payoffs than the ones which are completely passive.

So yeah, buff arcane pls.

Lets not go back to how Arcane Gens were the first time around ok? I will say that they're pretty much useless as is.

They aren't exactly useless, but their current purpose is similar to siege generators in that they help a winning team widen the gap rather than help break a stalemate. With good aim, its possible to really punch up a base with the shockwave and do a hefty amount of damage to their towers as well as smack up anything behind it on accident. I really would prefer a smaller tower with a buncha little aoe debuffs or something though, but that's just me.

Maybe they should get an Ubercharge skill:
Turns the target hero invulnerable for 10 seconds and plays the "I am ze Ubermensch!" sound.


Or other buffs...

A bomb generator will hit both lanes on Kedge's Landing. Hiding it in the middle near the marketplace or a bit further north/south in those tree areas where very few people go are excellent locations.

My favorite trick is to grab an anti magic potion, run out to a spawn wave with an enemy hero and hit the bomb generator detonation, then hit the anti magic potion. I safely take no damage, and the enemy hero gets smacked around and is usually easy pickings. Also good for teamkilling.

A bomb generator will hit both lanes on Kedge's Landing.

Why do people keep mentioning Kedges?! I don't hate the place, but Stormwail tends to be the standard map and the merits of generators should be judged on Stormwail.

Its easier to measure the range on kedge because the lanes have the same distance everywhere?

Just a few facts. Attack Generators cost only 5 crystal to deploy, and do 22-27 Hero damage. Siege Generators inflict 96-134 damage at 2400 range. Bomb Generators inflict approximately 1200 Pure damage on anything it hits; No damage reduction applies. Damage may be slightly less on heroes or it may be the same, I don't know. It's also worth mentioning that upgrading a Generator to Devastation cuts its HP from 1800 to 1400, and I think changes it's armor type as well... Devastation Generators have 600 range, Attack Generators, 800.