Eve of the Apocalypse: Twilight

An Aeon of Strife map for Warcraft 3
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PostPosted: July 13th, 2009, 3:47 am 
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In most games I play we play Stormwail; mostly because it's the only real working map (I'll get to why I say that in a second...) but also because it's the deepest in terms of strategy due to its size, the item selection and energy :x. Obviously with four maps eating away at the game's load time and my FPS it'd be really cool if all maps were equally enjoyable and could serve a purpose beyond frustrating everyone when they're picked.

I bring this thread up so we can talk about it and whatever you get it. I realize I made a thread on this earlier but I'm making one again in the Conclave so you guys can all out-post me and come up with better arguments/criticisms/w.e on both sides.

Gloomreap

The Bad
- The interface is too confusing for both vets and noobs. The criss-crossing lanes are frustrating to play on sometimes and while I get it, yeah that doesn't make it any better. As creative as it was the lanes just don't seem to be working out for Gloom.
- afaik there is no energy. Having no generators blows, and the map would get a lot more popular if we could build gens.
The Good
- Gloom's size and the bonus items on it make it unique and fun to play. The Murloc spawns are cool and it's nice to play on a map where you don't necessarily need to TP everywhere. It is unbelievably awesome as a flying hero.
- Gloom games tend to last about the right amount of time (45 mins-ish) and most of the time you can actually get to the other side and wreck their base.
- Gloom is green, my third favourite color.
Suggestions
- Straighten out the lanes (or most of them) and make it obvious where the troops are going.
- Implement energy.

Kedge's Landing
moar like crash landing amirite?

The Bad
- It crashes, you know.
- Left lane is far less important then the right lane. Although you can't just necessarily ignore it you can't also sit an equal amount of heroes on it comfortably).
The Good
- Just about everything else. I can't remember if there's energy; there really should be if there isn't (I think there is though.. 0_o).
Suggestions
- Somehow fix it (what a great suggestion I know...)

Candleburg
*sigh*

The Bad
- Candle is the most painful map to play in EotA. It is extremely chaotic, levelling is painfully slow and it's really hard to kill the other team.
- Despite being small, Candle has quite a bit of shit going on in it usually. Unfortunately, until heroes get ridiculously strong this never seems to result in much more then a bit of frustrated attempts at chipping away at towers (soon to be repaired or just rebuilt).
- Candle is an AoE dream. Tremor is brutal on this map and imo is almost game breaking late game (unless you have a Rue with aura on your team).
- It's the never ending song in EotA.
The Good
- Has the potential to be an excellent 2/3 player EotA map.
- Has the potential to be much shorter then regular EotA's, but perhaps almost as satisfying as other maps.
- Really pushes team work and hero combos more then any other map.
Suggestions
- Increase EXP gain to normal for all heroes, ignoring there are 5 there.
- I am not really sure how I feel about the way Candleburg's spawns work, but I think some reworking is needed. Base sieging shouldn't be instant destruction but in the later levels, with more hero support it should become a lot easier to take down towers and get closer to finishing the game. Perhaps having it so that you bought waves of spawns (like 3 waves) with the mana you spend would make it much more worthwhile.
- Give some Candle specific items that could increase the game speed a bit (perhaps an aoe nuke wand or something? good for heroes without AoE, but for heroes with AoE might just be a nice finisher? iono)

If this is redundant or doesn't need to be discussed I apologize for posting it we can just postpone it/remove it w/e.

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PostPosted: July 13th, 2009, 2:05 pm 
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All good points. The focus of 1.12d is suppose to be Kedge, but that doesn't mean i won't touch the other maps. Depending how the future plays out, other maps may get their own theme version as well.

Moontears are going to get changed in order to balance out the lanes some (I hope). While I'm not positive, I have a strong suspecion that Kedge crashes are related to the canon towers leaving fire pits behind, so those will be removed next version. On a similar note, some of the old creep upgrades used similar skills, and may have been the causes of old crashes.

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PostPosted: July 14th, 2009, 1:05 am 
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How bothersome having to log on this account. >_>

tonikaku... Towards Gloomreap and straightening out the lanes, I'm not for. Find an alternative if necessary, perhaps colored arrows on the playing field? The fact that lanes affect lanes affect other lanes is a major factor as to what makes Gloomreap what it is (in a good way).

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PostPosted: July 14th, 2009, 1:58 am 
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The big problem with Gloom's crossing lanes that I haven't heard anyone argue, is that it results in some fucked up exp distribution.

Example:
Blue's bottom lane (Let's call them Mine and Swamp). Swamp attacks Red's Swamp. Mine attacks Red's Island.
On Red's road lane, ther'es Island and Road. Road attacks Road. Island attacks Mine.

A hero, on bottom, able to hold the line before Mine breaks off to attack Island, has twice the exp gain as the other side. Similarly, a hero on Road able to hold off Island before it splits to attack Mine has the same situation. It basicly screws over your allies who are already fighting a hero that can hold off larger numbers of spawns. Now this obviously isn't always the case, but it makes exp distribution on Gloom really fucking weird. A specific real game had me at level 4 or so while there were level 10s and above, despite me never having left the front line of a lane from start of game.

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PostPosted: July 14th, 2009, 4:00 pm 
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Does this mean it gets fixed for next version?

>:D

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PostPosted: July 17th, 2009, 4:10 pm 
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Left lane should get a small neutral base. You gain control over it by controlling both mid towers. It allows (free and/or longer cooldown) teleport to it and maybe other benefits.
Because getting anywhere near combat on the left lane always takes incredibly long when you have the advantage, and the teleport to the last outpost is not really that far. Would also allow a little faster way to the right lane.
All in all it would be a very nice benefit for controlling the left lane imo.

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Dekar: the ultimate ocean themed hero should buff and depend on spawn waves!
DarnYak: why is that
Dekar: WAVES
Dekar: :D
DarnYak: i was afraid that was the answer


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