consumables, are they effective? usefull?

[Seig_2]

hmm, ive been browsing various coments to variuos topics and was wondering, how many of you guys fully or at least mostly spec your heros? i mean, it seems more and more people keep mentioning consumables to aviod certain problems. lol, most of the problems could be avoided if they didnt waste so much gold on consumables. dont get me wrong, i think some consumables a great for the price, just not all of them. i fequently buy health and mana potions at early lvls just to stay alive longer, but who need them by lvl 20? no one really. also, whats with people and the "dust" to aviod serra? 1/3 of the heros have a invis seeing spell. also, her backstab is physical, so why waste money on a consumable when you can get a permanant item that will be way more effetive anyway? (knight's armor):). believe me once u get past 50armor things like lunge, AoO, MS, do far less damage. Net? why, 3/4 of the heros have stuns, and whats with the amulet thing anyway? an invis Wizard? wth for? everyone knows just about any Str/Agi hero will rape him, and the ones that cant probably have stuns or silences. if you need to get that extra kill with xeld and are worried about staying alive get him a cuople of Str rings, i mean, vengence is upgraded by Str anyway, and it nvr hurts to have some extra hp, expecially with Int heros. anyway just thought id speak my mind, dont mean to make anyone mad, just think its kinds goofy that some people relay so much on consumables when they get outdated by lvl 20 anyway.

P.S. love to hear any coments or thoughts on this...

[Perhaps]

Dust of Appearance is 75 gold.
Has 5 charges.
Costs no mana.

Amulet of Detection costs 500 Gold.
I don't know the mana cost, because I forgot to record it in the wiki.

    You would need to use the amulet of detection about 33 times to even match the cost of consumables. 34 times to have made it barely worth your while.

Wand of Negation costs 160 gold
Has 3 charges.
Costs no mana

Staff of Negation costs 720 gold
Again forgot to research the mana cost for the wiki.

    You would need to use staff of negation about 13 times to be an even match the cost of comsumables. And 14 times to have made it barely worth the cost. Staff of Negation is probably the perminent item that probably easily slams consumables. Since 13 in a half game is fairly practical.

   Since Zephyr Totem is an only one item in the game, I won't bother going into details the difference between Zephyr Totem and Dimensional Wand.

    There is no perminent item for the other consumables, well other than potion of health.

    Scroll of Travel is probably the least practicle of the group, since it requries structures, and pretty much every where you need to go that has a structure or structures, has a building that can warp you for a cheaper cost.

    Anti-mage potion is nice from time to time, like blocking Vengence. Or all kinds of other nasty magic damage/cast hits. It may cost you 120 gold, but if it saves you, that's 400 gold a player doesn't get, and 10 crystals per player of team that they don't get. In a sense that's a profiet.

    Potion of Invisiblity, similar concept, a trump kill, a cost of 100, but you'd make 400, a direct 300 gold profiet, plus crystals for team. There are plenty of skills that hurt but are a pain to land, that this would be nice with.

    Battleplans, are really nice. Well, primarily for the purpose of ordering army to go to a "safe obelisk" for support of seige on one.

    Healing Salves and Clarity potions are dirt cheap, and since there's a lot of travel time on the map. It's like having a mobile fountain really.

    There are players who are really annoying who do this spaztic in and out crap, that really isn't effective, but annoying all the same (DotA players I call them, because I know that's where it comes from), Wand of Shadowsight is really nice for the likes of them. Or just players who hit and run in general. It also costs 75 per charge, so if it leads to a kill, that's a direct profiet of 325 gold plus crystals. Or it can keep your from dying, and that's 400 gold they don't get plus crystals. People always want to maphack, and for good reasons, consider this similar but legit.

      Frozen Skull is a nice AoE damage for heros that don't get AoE.

    Enchanted Shell, well probably my least favorite of the summon types, I suppose if a player isn't compitent enough to use dispell, they can build up pretty well. And them killing, will make you the gold you spent for them and more. They also reproduce, not sure how it works exactly though.

    Serpent Wards are nice little support things to make a dandy buck, setting up a quick light front, or just putting them at towers to get freebee kills here and there when a force gets to your towers but you're not there for it. And if you place then spread enough so they all don't get hit at once, it levels the cost of negation charge, but if they took too long to do it, then you've got a few kills here and there so you won in that economical situation. ^_^ .b

    Skeletons, are a very very nice summon item, I consider tham a superior version of Frozen Skull, but if I get skeletons after the use, that's nice. For 290 which costs less than first tier Mercenaries (Not saying they're superior to first tier Mercinaries). Taking damage, doing damage, a helpful item. You can sometimes trap a hero by spawning on top and surrounding, if it kills, it's a 110 gold profeit + crystals for team.

    Sludge Monstrousity is a nice meat bag, and at certain stages can't be hurt by dispell, which I don't remember anymore. Lot's of health to begin with, when dies, splits.

    I haven't found much use for the Charms, maybe someone can fill that part in. -_-

    Trapping net, again the kill profeit scenario, and as well as dealing with air Heros.

   I've used Termite Jar for persistant not to die towers. It's really nice for that, as an ice breaker.

   Cluster Rockets... Meh for the cost.

[Seig_2]

Hmm, termites are good and so are some others but why worry so much about them? 500g buys you a ring of your choice. worried about vengeance? get some Str. vengeance against and Str or even buffed Agi hero is a joke, and Str hero can rape Wizzy. I dont know, some of them seem good for the price, i just think they should be bought at a minimum for certain purposes.

[Dekar]

Scroll of Travel works on units, too.

I usually buy it near the end of the game to save me walking to the enemys mainbase.

Other items I use:

Healing Salves and Clarity potions
Skull
Amulet of Detection ( if it is really really needed )


Ofc there are sometimes situations ( the few games I may lose of thefew games I play ) that make me use other consumeables, too:

A BP can easily be countered with Wand of Negation ( Staff deals not enough damage per second for all the dispell you may need ).

etc.

[BLUEPOWERVAN]

Consumables are the best items in the game. Every single summon you can buy (especially/including ward support) will more than make up its cost in gold, even if you just leave it unassisted in a back lane. That's aside from their strategic value in providing meat to defend/attack obelisks, or their tactical value in trapping escaping enemy heroes.

Clarity potions definitely make you a lot of money, as well as allowing you to deny enemy heroes of xp by liberally nuking, and healing salves help you stay in the lane when confronted.

Occaisionally I will use suicide squads and possibly termites to solo towers. Honestly, most of the rest of them have their uses as well to varying degrees, those were just my most common picks.

Actual item builds, well, it's usually pretty obvious, you pick whatever stat item is best, or frequently the blink totem. I know tox does great using the blink consumable (for 3 charges usually a couple kills and an avoided death).

[Seig_2]

Your right, they probably will, but all that space your using (and gold) for killing creeps could go to rings or whatever to aid your AoE if you have one that is. If your talking about using them for heros like Fenny, Rue, Adrin, someone that doesn't have an AoE than I say forget massing items and go for consumables! I mean, doesn't it make more sense to get Wizard's HS up than to buy serpent wards or skele minions? I think so, maybe im wrong, but thats my op.

[Strychnyne]

so why waste money on a consumable when you can get a permanant item that will be way more effetive anyway? (knight's armor):). believe me once u get past 50armor things like lunge, AoO, MS, do far less damage. if you need to get that extra kill with xeld and are worried about staying alive get him a cuople of Str rings

It's the cost. All the gold you sank into a full Knight's Armour could've been spent on mercs, additional heroes, repairs... The amont of money you put into that permanent item will rarely give you profit, especially when consumable options exist.

[AnAngryBearDoctor]

It's the cost. All the gold you sank into a full Knight's Armour could've been spent on mercs, additional heroes, repairs... The amont of money you put into that permanent item will rarely give you profit, especially when consumable options exist.

Spend money on hiring people? wth for? whats the point of having 6 slots and all those items if your not going to use them? i think hiring masses of heros and spawns is a gay noob way to win, a truely skilled Eota lies NOT in the ability to hire more creeps than your enemies but in the skill and build of your hero. lets face it, if your where to consentrate your gold on hiring creeps and went against a fully or even partailly specd hero you'd get raped no matter what hero your were. everyone knows that 90% of the heroes in eota can 1 shot the creeps by lvl 30 so you would just be feeding them MORE gold! what a theory, no my friend, more items need to be added and LESS of creeps needed to be added. anyway.
--Sieg_2

You obviously aren't thinking from a pro's point of view.
Scrub.

[Seig_2]

I mentioned nothing of repairs, mercs or whatever, just pointless consumables (some). I frequently hire creeps and repair and said nothing against it. You made it up.

[Soulbourne]

Actually I posted in reply to that...

[Seig_2]

oh.

[Storamin]

oh.

PWND!!!!!!!!

[Ion]

Well I reinstalled this shit. Can't believe you mofos are still playing.

Get on noobs.

[genrap993]

Are the dead rising up?

[Ion]

I guess.

[jamn455]

Oh god... can it really be?

[Soulbourne]

Is it by coincidence that at the same time the forums come alive the clan on azeroth is active enough to be called among the living? Yes there playing EotA....

[ashwa]

After reading about demigod it reminded me so much of eota that i need to get playing again

[Konnar]

Hells yes !

[Perhaps]

It's the cost. All the gold you sank into a full Knight's Armour could've been spent on mercs, additional heroes, repairs... The amont of money you put into that permanent item will rarely give you profit, especially when consumable options exist.

    However that armor could be the ticket that prevented you from needing those things. Then have it be perminent. ^_^ .b

    Consumables aren't too much to rely one, you definently want perminents as some sort of power retention. But as far as perminent items, such as the Knight Armor, which I'm not too fond of for its cost. Is knowing when you have enough, and stop upgrading and that excess can be put into other things, or you can do it the other way around, spend the consumables only as needed and put your excess into perminents. Sadly, Tavern Heros are just as of a "must buy" as obelisks are, so Tavern Heros take priority in spending after Safe Obelisks are placed.

[Strychnyne]

It really depends on the hero I guess. Permanents are a guarantee if I'm playing Swashbuckler for instance, but usually the only item I'd get is the Orb of Mana, level three maybe. Other than that it's consumables and toys from the Goblins shop.

What I meant about repairs and such is that in the item builds you describe for your heroes you'd have NO gold for anything else, so consumables would be the only way to go since they're cheap and do the trick of permanents in a pinch.

[Perhaps]

    One thing to consider, but I can't be religious about myself, but it is a practical thought. Which is the fact that items sell for full price, so you could buy perminent items, and when you go to a shop to get consumables, you can sell the item to really push for full potential. Since players don't pose enough of a challenge it's something I haven't put too much desire into trying.

I might add Race only consumables may be a cool thing as well.

[Seig_2]

It's the cost. All the gold you sank into a full Knight's Armour could've been spent on mercs, additional heroes, repairs... The amont of money you put into that permanent item will rarely give you profit, especially when consumable options exist.

    However that armor could be the ticket that prevented you from needing those things. Then have it be perminent. ^_^ .b

    Consumables aren't too much to rely one, you definently want perminents as some sort of power retention. But as far as perminent items, such as the Knight Armor, which I'm not too fond of for its cost. Is knowing when you have enough, and stop upgrading and that excess can be put into other things, or you can do it the other way around, spend the consumables only as needed and put your excess into perminents. Sadly, Tavern Heros are just as of a "must buy" as obelisks are, so Tavern Heros take priority in spending after Safe Obelisks are placed.

The way I look at is this, some heros farm alot faster than others, thats a given, so they're is naturally going to be more gold for perminents. Take Xeldarith for instance, Holy strike is a way better farming tool than serpant wards, wretched skull, frozen skull, or enchanted shell, and it doesn't cost gold. Honestly, I don't see the point in those Items, Health and Mana consumables yes, but army consums? why when you can hire creeps or buff your AoE? As far as hired heros? eh, I think they're good for pushes, but so is a good pushing hero with perminents. Now can a single hero push like three hired ones? probably not, so hired are definately good for extra power, but not too much else. Most games I play we don't use obelisks, so hired heros and stuff like that become useless. My friend sometimes uses spell canceling consums and he still dies so as far as those go not sure what to say, some of the heros have spell removers and the ones that do don't need those. Amulet of detection seems ok I guess, although some heros have true sight. Amulet of health seems pointless, get a health orb, healer, or ring, about 50% of the heros have heals anyway. Mana consums are good for early game but become anoying and pointless in late play. Also, OFB is a great farming Item and cheap, or OFF and Dragon's Heart if you've got the money.